St. X vs Manual

Page 3 of Originally Posted by Trinity alum The high schools in Jefferson County are large enough to be able to teach all levels. The have not schools of Jeffers... 99 comments | 3935 Views | Go to page 1 →

  1. #31
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    No we aren't as guilty as Sexton because there is a fundmental difference. First of all we don't have a vote. I know that we could storm the school and write very stringent letters that would be ignored, but frankly it is not worth doing it when there is little chance that it is going to pass for one, and two because it is clear to us that it is not really the objective of the public schools to kick out the private schools, it is leverage to pass other legislation that they hope to use to equalize the percieved advantage as to compete on a level playing field. Now I for one still don't think the other legislation will accomplish that goal either, but I am not ready to jump on the sword of self rightousness for the greater good of Kentucky High School football by distancing myself from the program I love and work to support, just because of a maybe might be , off chance that prop 20 is passed and then will only be rejected by the Board of controllers.
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  2. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by ram95
    The first lesson I ever had in politics was that the appearence of impropriety is as dangerous as a real impropriety, since it is almost impossible to prove a negitive. There is no such thing as due process in public opinion. Sad but true. While it is unfair, the burden of proof lies with privates to prove to the public at large that for every Non-Catholic athlete from a bad neighborhood that goes to the private school on need based aid, there is also another Non-Catholic non-athlete student from the same bad neighborhood in the same situation that is getting aid as well. As it stands the image on the street is that the good athletes or exceptional student might get to go to private school with aid, but no aid is offered to the normal kids. Until it is apparent and it is well understood that financial aid is not tied to the promise of athletic preformance, then it will be an issue. Fair or not.
    That may be as big a pile of manure as I've ever read. And I had to edit it to make it say manure. First this isn't politics, it is our kids. Second, the education officials of this state have a duty to all children, not just the children of public schools. If athletic scholarships are being given it is against the rules. The burden of proof is on those who would make the charge. Third, there is copious evidence that the financial aid is awarded properly. The private schools have to use a service that is approved by the KHSAA. Sexton knows that. The Manual principal knows that. Every one of the miserable excuses for a human being making these proposals should know it.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trinity alum
    That may be as big a pile of manure as I've ever read. And I had to edit it to make it say manure. First this isn't politics, it is our kids. Second, the education officials of this state have a duty to all children, not just the children of public schools. If athletic scholarships are being given it is against the rules. The burden of proof is on those who would make the charge. Third, there is copious evidence that the financial aid is awarded properly. The private schools have to use a service that is approved by the KHSAA. Sexton knows that. The Manual principal knows that. Every one of the miserable excuses for a human being making these proposals should know it.
    No one doubts that every kid that receives aid NEEDS it. But if the school or its representative is only beating down the doors of the kids that can ran fast, juke quick, jump hurdles etc., to let them know about that aid, it feels wrong. That's what ram95 means.

    And maybe it just seems like that because people REMEMBER the athletic kid. But like ram95 said, when its political, its about perception. To dispell that perception, X and T could do a lot of things, like publish name-stricken reports of the kids that get aid, and show that there are plenty that can be identified as minorities from disadvantaged areas that didn't also happen to be great ball players.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by All Tell
    OK I'm sorry, I hate to do this because I don't like posts that correct someone's spelling but since the Manual people seem to get so upset about swapping an "e" for an "a" I have to do it because it is driving me crazy. (Some would say it's not a drive but a short putt)

    A principal is the person in charge of a school
    A principle is a basic truth or idea
    I would also say there's a big difference between accidental mispelling, and putting the mispelling bold and in quotes to be irritating. The name of a Duke basketball player comes to mind. In other forums the mods have been happy to point out that it is not up to us to either enforce or break rule 13 to make points in debate.

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    Everyone, back on topic, or I'll have to close the thread.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rockmom
    Everyone, back on topic, or I'll have to close the thread.
    Isn't there already an 'everyone gang up on Manual' thread anyway? Not to mention that this topic (a lot of Catholic kids go to Manual) was already brought up in the game thread, and hasn't been addressed in this thread since we all pointed out, AGAIN, that yes a lot of Catholics go to Manual, period, athletes and non-athletes.

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    If we can stay on topic, then the discussion continues. Otherwise, the thread will have to be closed. I don't want to do that, but we NEED to stay on topic, please.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 02Ram54
    No one doubts that every kid that receives aid NEEDS it. But if the school or its representative is only beating down the doors of the kids that can ran fast, juke quick, jump hurdles etc., to let them know about that aid, it feels wrong. That's what ram95 means.

    And maybe it just seems like that because people REMEMBER the athletic kid. But like ram95 said, when its political, its about perception. To dispell that perception, X and T could do a lot of things, like publish name-stricken reports of the kids that get aid, and show that there are plenty that can be identified as minorities from disadvantaged areas that didn't also happen to be great ball players.
    The whole tone of the ram95 post was offensive. He is asking the private schools to prove a negative. That is an unreasonable burden. The evidence is out there. It is not necessary to show the distribution of kids that get aid. The smoking gun would be for someone to find a kid that was either given aid in excess of what the independent rating service said they should receive OR to find a nonathlete that applied for aid, was qualified to receive aid and then denied aid. That evidence does not exist. What sickens me is that people like Sexton and the Manual principal KNOW the procedures used by the private schools and they choose to ignore that information. I find them disgusting.

  9. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by 02Ram54
    No one doubts that every kid that receives aid NEEDS it. But if the school or its representative is only beating down the doors of the kids that can ran fast, juke quick, jump hurdles etc., to let them know about that aid, it feels wrong. That's what ram95 means.

    And maybe it just seems like that because people REMEMBER the athletic kid. But like ram95 said, when its political, its about perception. To dispell that perception, X and T could do a lot of things, like publish name-stricken reports of the kids that get aid, and show that there are plenty that can be identified as minorities from disadvantaged areas that didn't also happen to be great ball players.

    I don't think that legally, private schools can release that information. What would it prove anyway, though. Without the names, people will still perceive the 40% that get aid as athletes.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockmom
    I don't think that legally, private schools can release that information. What would it prove anyway, though. Without the names, people will still perceive the 40% that get aid as athletes.
    They can release a statistical report without identifying information. Area code and race would suffice to show the info I mentioned.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 02Ram54
    Isn't there already an 'everyone gang up on Manual' thread anyway?
    Where is it, I missed it

    j/k

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    Quote Originally Posted by 02Ram54
    They can release a statistical report without identifying information. Area code and race would suffice to show the info I mentioned.

    Do you feel this is something that private schools "owe" the public schools? What if it were requested that similar information be requested of public schools?

    Race is not a question on the financial aid form, by the way. It is illegal to ask that question.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockmom
    Do you feel this is something that private schools "owe" the public schools? What if it were requested that similar information be requested of public schools?

    Race is not a question on the financial aid form, by the way. It is illegal to ask that question.
    I don't think it's owed, I'm saying it would be a good idea if it would show that X and T don't only give out financial aid to disadvantaged minorities if they also happen to be athletes.

    Our financial aid report would be pretty short...

    So X and T have no idea which of their students are on financial aid? This is a report, not a stack of forms with blacked out names that I'm talking about.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 02Ram54
    I don't think it's owed, I'm saying it would be a good idea if it would show that X and T don't only give out financial aid to disadvantaged minorities if they also happen to be athletes.

    Our financial aid report would be pretty short...

    So X and T have no idea which of their students are on financial aid? This is a report, not a stack of forms with blacked out names that I'm talking about.

    We have an idea...approximately 40%.

    We do not ask for the race of our students on the financial aid form. That is not considered in the decision.

  15. #45

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    I know no one has (or will) probably bothered to investigate, but here's a link to the Trinity page describing the financial aid procedure:


    Financial Aid

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