UNC's Athletic Directors thoughts on the academic scandal

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    UNC's Athletic Directors thoughts on the academic scandal

    In an exclusive interview with CBS Sports' Dennis Dodd, University of North Carolina Athletic Director Bubba Cunningham opened up about the ongoing NCAA investigation into the school's academic fraud case and revealed that he believed the school may have been "overcharged" by the association.
    The investigation into the school, which has now lasted six years, began when a faulty transcript in another case revealed what appeared to be a trail of bogus classes stretching back 18 years. It's an unprecedented case that has been in the hands of the NCAA for an unusually long time. It's also a case that, according to Dodd's report, involved 3,100 students in those classes -- about half of which were student-athletes. So it's an unusually long investigation for an equally unusual case.
    North Carolina has been charged by the NCAA with unethical conduct, lack of institutional control, and extra benefits provided by a perpetrator of a bogus class scheme.
    UNC received its third notice of allegations in December -- its second amended notice -- which was given out after the school challenged the NCAA's authority in the case.
    For Cunningham, the worry is that the history of handing down harsh punishments in scandals such as Penn State, USC and Miami, will again draw "an overreach" by the NCAA. He is hoping the association will come down with less crippling results.
    "[Those] are the three cases that we continue to bring back, [saying], 'You're doing it again. Don't do it,'" said Cunningham.
    From a basketball perspective, the worry for UNC is simple: The NCAA broadened its investigation into the school to include the years 2002-2011 in its latest NOA. That could mean the 2005 and 2009 basketball National Championships could reasonably be in jeopardy.
    Citing sources, Dodd reports that this could mean penalties such as scholarship reductions, postseason bans, or vacated wins could conceivably be in play.
    Said Cunningham: "Is this academic fraud? Yes, it is by a normal person's standards. But by the NCAA definition [it is not]. Later adding: "I'm telling you what happened was bad, but it's not against the rules. So you have to change the rules."

    North Carolina AD on academic fraud case: It was bad, but wasn't against the rules - CBSSports.com

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    Nothing to see here.

    It's the Tar Heel Way.

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    Said Cunningham: "Is this academic fraud? Yes, it is by a normal person's standards. But by the NCAA definition [it is not]. Later adding: "I'm telling you what happened was bad, but it's not against the rules. So you have to change the rules."

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    Quote Originally Posted by sweet16 View Post
    Said Cunningham: "Is this academic fraud? Yes, it is by a normal person's standards. But by the NCAA definition [it is not]. Later adding: "I'm telling you what happened was bad, but it's not against the rules. So you have to change the rules."
    He's full of bull. The NCAA has taken action many times in the past after learning of violations. They can't cop out with this UNC case by saying they have no control over college classes and grades! If this had happened at Middle Tennessee or Portland they would have come to a decision long ago and taken away wins, scholarships, etc. But it's North Carolina, a blueblood, so they have to search for excuses and loopholes.

    The NCAA told Memphis to go ahead and play Rose and later discovered that Rose had cheated on his ACT that he took in Chicago. So, after the fact of giving Memphis the greenlight to play him they later hit Memphis with the news that they had stripped the university of their Final Four as well as their wins for that season.
    What would keep the same NCAA of holding UNC accountable for academic fraud and stripping them of their wins and banners. Just like in the Rose case the knowledge of what happened wasn't known until the news broke. Double standard all the way!

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    I have to agree 100%. The fact that the AD is arguing by saying "it's a rule but not by NCAA standards", should make anyone who is proud to be associated with UNC, cringe. Total joke/sham. I'm not one who is big on taking away wins and banners bc the games have already been played with results. I am big on probation, loss of scholarships, etc.

    Everyone who has a rooting interest in a college program knows how two faced the NCAA truly is, and this case will make it that much more obvious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Professor View Post
    He's full of bull. The NCAA has taken action many times in the past after learning of violations. They can't cop out with this UNC case by saying they have no control over college classes and grades! If this had happened at Middle Tennessee or Portland they would have come to a decision long ago and taken away wins, scholarships, etc. But it's North Carolina, a blueblood, so they have to search for excuses and loopholes.

    The NCAA told Memphis to go ahead and play Rose and later discovered that Rose had cheated on his ACT that he took in Chicago. So, after the fact of giving Memphis the greenlight to play him they later hit Memphis with the news that they had stripped the university of their Final Four as well as their wins for that season.
    What would keep the same NCAA of holding UNC accountable for academic fraud and stripping them of their wins and banners. Just like in the Rose case the knowledge of what happened wasn't known until the news broke. Double standard all the way!
    UNC winning those national championships in basketball during the years under investigation, is the one thing stopping the NCAA from truly doing anything IMO. They rarely if ever truly go after teams, or strip teams of things in years they won a title. However if you were a runner up, or anything like that they have no problem.

    If Memphis wins the title, they never get anything taken away from them IMO. While Kansas who I believe also was found to have someone on the team who violated something, would have been the team to vacate their wins. However since they won it, that got overlooked.

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    Quote Originally Posted by futurecoach View Post
    UNC winning those national championships in basketball during the years under investigation, is the one thing stopping the NCAA from truly doing anything IMO. They rarely if ever truly go after teams, or strip teams of things in years they won a title. However if you were a runner up, or anything like that they have no problem.



    TohIf Memphis wins the title, they never get anything taken away from them IMO. While Kansas who I believe also was found to have someone on the team who violated something, would have been the team to vacate their wins. However since they won it, that got overlooked.
    Tell that to the Thomass More College Women's National Championship Team

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    Quote Originally Posted by Theoldguy View Post
    Tell that to the Thomass More College Women's National Championship Team
    Yeah but TMC let a player stay with a coach while rehabbing an injury...that is WAY worse than having bogus classes FOR ALMOST TWO DECADES for 3,000 students with about 1,500 of them being athletes...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Theoldguy View Post
    Tell that to the Thomass More College Women's National Championship Team
    Small division 3 school that probably never even made national news. They can afford to do that to small schools and no hurt their brand or history. Makes it look like the division 1 Champs all won it the right way. They don't dare strip d1 Champs for fear out of making their sport championships look tainted.

    You bringing up Thomas More is the perfect example. They still haven't touched UNC for a much bigger scandal. Yet they stripped little old Thomas More for something very small.

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    Maryland's president thinks North Carolina should get the death penalty

    Maryland president Wallace Loh says he would expect death penalty for North Carolina Tar Heels athletics

    Maryland president Wallace Loh says he would expect North Carolina to get the "death penalty" over the academic allegations that have hung over the athletic program since 2010.

    "As president, I sit over a number of dormant volcanoes," Loh said during a University of Maryland senate meeting Thursday, according to the Raleigh News & Observer. "One of them is an athletic scandal. It blows up, it blows up the university, its reputation, it blows up the president.

    "For the things that happened in North Carolina, it's abysmal. I would think that this would lead to the implementation of the death penalty by the NCAA. But I'm not in charge of that."

    A Maryland spokesperson later said in a statement that Loh's comments were "not a reflection of personal beliefs about the university or its leadership."

    Joel Curran, vice chancellor of communications at North Carolina, said school officials were taken aback by Loh's statement.

    "We were surprised that a sitting university president with no direct knowledge of our case would choose to offer such uninformed and highly speculative opinions," Curran wrote in an email.

    The Tar Heels won a men's basketball national title this month amid the shadow of an NCAA investigation into the school's long-running academic fraud scandal involving athletes in numerous sports, tied to irregularities in an academic department from 1993 to 2011 and leading to five broad-based charges against the school that include lack of institutional control.

    "For the things that happened in North Carolina, it's abysmal. I would think that this would lead to the implementation of the death penalty by the NCAA."
    Maryland president Wallace Loh, on the academic allegations against North Carolina
    The NCAA began investigating the program in 2010, reopened its inquiry in summer 2014 and first charged North Carolina in a notice of allegations filed in May 2015. The NCAA revised the charges in a second version in April 2016 and changed them again in a third version filed in December.

    The investigation is currently delayed while the school and the NCAA work on a new schedule for North Carolina to file its response to the third NOA, as the attorney for a woman at the center of the scandal said he is working to set up an interview after she had previously refused to speak with investigators.

    North Carolina men's basketball coach Roy Williams said before the national title game that his program in particular did nothing wrong.

    "Were there some mistakes made? You're darned right there were. Were there some things I wish hadn't happened? You're darned right. But there were no allegations against men's basketball," Williams said. "Do I believe again that our institution, there were some mistakes, you're darned right I do. I'm very mad, sad, ticked off, any way you want to put all that terminology about it, embarrassed and all those things too."

    Williams' program is referenced along with the football team in the third NOA, though no coaches or program staffers are charged with misconduct.

    Williams said the length of the investigation in some ways has been a punishment for his program.

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    I agree.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wireman View Post
    I agree.
    With the Maryland President or with Ol' Roy?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hatz View Post
    With the Maryland President or with Ol' Roy?
    With the Maryland president. Roy is lying. There were direct allegations against men's basketball.

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    Personally I think Dean Smith, Bill Guthridge, Matt Doherty and Roy Williams all knew about it in the same way that John Wooden knew about Sam Gilbert. They looked the other way and made sure that any incriminating knowledge could not be linked to them.

    I can't tell you how many UNC fans point out Cal's horrible track record at UMass and Memphis and say, "He had to know what was going on!"

    If it's good for the goose, it's good for the gander.

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